天人合一 【问与答】究竟有没有可能真正地摆脱所有依赖?

【问与答】究竟有没有可能真正地摆脱所有依赖?

Questioner:I should like to understand the nature of dependence. I have found myself depending on so many things – on women, on different kinds of amusement, on good wine, on my wife and children, on my friends, on what people say. Fortunately I no longer depend on religious entertainment, but I depend on the books I read to stimulate me and on good conversation. I see that the young are also dependent, perhaps not so much as I am, but they have their own particular forms of dependence. I have been to the East and have seen how there they depend on the guru and the family. Tradition there has greater importance and is more deeply rooted than it is here in Europe, and, of course, very much more so than in America. But we all seem to depend on something to sustain us, not only physically but, much more, inwardly. So I am wondering whether it is at all possible to be really free of dependence, and should one be free of it?

提问者:我想了解依赖的本质。我发觉自己对很多事物都有依赖,我依赖女人、各种娱乐、美酒、妻子和孩子、朋友以及人们的言论。幸运的是,我不再依赖宗教的把戏了,但我还得靠读书来激励自己,还依赖良好的交谈。我看到年轻人同样也有依赖性,也许没有我这样严重吧,但他们有自己特定的依赖形式。我曾到过东方,看到那里的人是多么依赖上师和家庭。比起欧洲这里,传统在那儿显得更加重要,更加根深蒂固,当然,与美国相比,就更甚了。但是似乎我们所有人都依赖某些东西才能生存下去,不仅身体层面是这样,内在更是如此。因此我想知道,究竟有没有可能真正地摆脱所有依赖,而且人是不是应该从中解脱?

Krishnamurti:I take it you are concerned with the psychological inward attachments. The more one is attached the greater the dependence. The attachment is not only to persons but to ideas and to things. One is attached to a particular environment, to a particular country and so on. And from this springs dependence and therefore resistance.

克:我想你关心的是心理上内在的执着。一个人越是执着,依赖性就越强。执着的对象不仅可以是人,也可以是观念和实物。一个人可能执着于某种特定的环境,一个特定的国家等等。从执着中就产生了依赖,进而产生了抗拒。

Questioner:Why resistance?

提问者:为什么会有抗拒?

Krishnamurti:The object of my attachment is my territorial or my sexual domain. This I protect, resisting any form of encroachment on it from others. I also limit the freedom of the person to whom I am attached and limit my own freedom. So attachment is resistance. I am attached to something or somebody. That attachment is possessiveness; possessiveness is resistance, so attachment is resistance.

克:我执着的对象就是我的领地或我的性范畴。我要保护它们,抵抗任何形式的外来入侵。我也限制了我所执着的那个人的自由,同时也为自己的自由设了限。所以,执着就是抗拒。我执着于某人或某物。那种执着就是占有;占有就是抗拒,因此,执着就是抗拒。

Questioner:Yes, I see that.

提问者:是的,我明白这一点。

Krishnamurti:Any form of encroachment on my possessions leads to violence, legally or psychologically. So attachment is violence, resistance, imprisonment – the imprisonment of oneself and of the object of attachment. Attachment means this is mine and not yours; keep off! So this relationship is resistance against others. The whole world is divided into mine and yours: my opinion, my judgement, my advice, my God, my country – an infinity of such nonsense. Seeing all this taking place, not in abstraction but actually in our daily life, we can ask why there is this attachment to people, things and ideas.

克:如果我的财产被人以任何形式侵占,就会导致暴力,通过法律,或者在心理上与其对抗。因此,执着即暴力、抗拒和牢笼——执着的主体和对象都被囚禁了。执着意味着”这是我的,不是你的;离远点!”由此可见,这种关系乃是对别人的抗拒。整个世界被分成了你的和我的:我的观点,我的判断,我的建议,我的上帝,我的国家——这样的无稽之谈从未休止。看到所有这些事情实实在在地发生在我们的日常生活中,而不是在抽象的思维中,我们会问为什么会有对人、事物和观念的依赖。

Why does one depend? All being is relationship and all relationship is in this dependence with its violence, resistance and domination. We have made the whole world into this. Where one possesses one must dominate. We meet beauty, love springs up, and immediately it turns to attachment and all this misery begins and the love has gone out of the window. Then we ask, “What has happened to our great love?” This is actually what is happening in our daily life. And, seeing all this, we can now ask: why is man invariably attached, not only to that which is lovely, but also to every form of illusion and to so many idiotic fancies?

为什么人要依赖?一切存在都是关系,所有的关系都处于这种依赖中,与之相伴的是暴力、抗拒和控制。是我们把整个世界变得如此。哪里有占据,哪里就必然会有控制。我们遇见了一个美人,爱情喷涌而出,很快,爱情变成了执着,所有这些苦恼就都开始了,然后爱就悄悄溜出了窗外。之后,我们会问,”我们伟大的爱情到底怎么了?”这就是我们日常生活中实际发生着的事情。看到这一切,我们不禁会问:为什么人类一味地执着,不仅执着于美丽的事物,还执着于各种形式的幻觉以及数不清的愚蠢念头?

Freedom is not a state of non-dependence; it is a positive state in which there isn’t any dependence. But it is not a result, it has no cause. This must be understood very clearly before we can go into the question of why man depends or falls into the trap of attachment with all its miseries. Being attached we try to cultivate a state of independence – which is another form of resistance.

自由并不是非依赖状态;这是一种积极的状态,其中没有任何的依赖。但它不是结果,也没有起因。在我们深入探讨人类为何依赖或陷入执着的陷阱以及所有与之相伴的痛苦之前,必须清楚地理解上面这点。一旦有执着,我们就会想办法培养一种独立的状态——而这恰是另一种形式的抗拒。

The Urgency of Change – ‘Dependence’

《转变的紧迫性》之”依赖”


Blogger 于 3/19/2014 05:08:00 下午 发布在 天人合一

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